TRANSCRIPT OF MEDIA INTERVIEW BY MINISTER FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS GEORGE YEO FOLLOWING THE CLOSING CEREMONY OF THE 43RD ASEAN MINISTERIAL MEETING AND RELATED MEETINGS, 23 JULY 2010, HANOI

TRANSCRIPT OF MEDIA INTERVIEW BY MINISTER FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS GEORGE YEO FOLLOWING THE CLOSING CEREMONY OF THE 43RD ASEAN MINISTERIAL MEETING AND RELATED MEETINGS, 23 JULY 2010, HANOI

Minister: Well, we had a good series of meetings the last few days. It ended well. ASEAN as a whole has been able to maintain its centrality and it is quite a triumph for ASEAN diplomacy --- that all the major powers of the world now accept that the regional architecture for Asia as a whole should be built around ASEAN at its core, and ASEAN should play a leading role. The key to all this is of course that we have got to stay united and become even more integrated. It is not a birthright. It is a position that we've achieved by effort and it can only be maintained by greater effort.

But on the whole, the fact that we are now enlarging the EAS, with the US and Russia showing interest, is very significant because with their inclusion, the picture is now largely complete. They are the major powers. They, together with the existing members of the EAS, are the major powers affecting the big issues of war and peace in the region in this century. And we now said these are the areas of priority, these are the subjects of interest, it will maintain a regional focus. And year by year we will develop form and function, and it will help to maintain peace and conditions conducive for development. Everybody can now sense that the global centre of gravity, the economic centre of gravity, is shifting to Asia. And we are right in the middle of it. It places upon us a certain responsibility, indeed a heavy responsibility, but it also means all kinds of new opportunities which we could never have imagined before. So I would say, on the whole at the closing ceremony, the ASEAN Foreign Ministers felt quite satisfied that we are making good progress, even though we know that the future will still be an effort.

The Vietnamese Chair has done very well. They have been methodical, very detailed and meticulous in their planning. They have provided good Wi-Fi facilities, have attended to small details, and ensured that the agenda is followed and the objectives achieved.

This morning at the ARF (ASEAN Regional Forum) [there were] two important subjects of discussion: the Korean Peninsula and the South China Sea --- very robust exchanges which had everybody's attention fully captured.

On North Korea, as we had expected, the DPRK (Democratic People's Republic of Korea) denied responsibility for the torpedo attack on the Cheonan ship. We did not expect that it (the ARF Chairman's Statement) will go beyond the UN Security Council President's statement. But it is interesting that the North Korean Foreign Minister Pak Ui Chun, whom I have known for three years now, took pains to lobby every ASEAN foreign minister. So they (DPRK) too feel that they've got to make the argument, and that it is a battle of hearts and minds.

So too, the South Korean Foreign Minister, who made sure that we all understood their arguments and understood the injury, the injustice, done to them. I thought even though the outcome was what we expected, the process itself was good because it established a certain norm or behaviour --- that, well, it is not just might that is right, but you must win the argument and every member has to be won over to your side, to your point of view. And also there was recognition that the way to the future is economic development. I found it significant that the North Korean Foreign Minster said we want to concentrate on economic development but we must have a favourable external environment. So everybody agreed that the way forward is through the Six-Party Talks, and that we have got to develop conditions favourable to those talks making progress.

The other subject of intense discussion was the South China Sea and here, there was quite an interesting and sharp exchange between the Americans and the Chinese. At some points, the atmosphere was just a little tense but, overall, civil and focused on the argument. I think the boundaries are now largely marked out, that the countries around the table were not going to interfere in bilateral territory disputes. But everybody has an abiding interest in the freedom of navigation and that these disputes should not affect the overall atmosphere of free trade and of easy movement. There is also an expectation that conflict should be settled in a civilised way through negotiation, and through a spirit of neighbourliness; not through coercion or force. Here, the Declaration of Conduct [in the South China Sea] between China and ASEAN is very important. The Chinese Foreign Minister made an important point that it is not really between China and ASEAN, but it's really among the countries which include China and ASEAN because these are all claimant states. It is not just China having disputes with particular ASEAN countries, it is also particular ASEAN countries, claimant states, having disputes between themselves. This is a declaration of conduct which everybody should be bound by.

We are now working on the implementation details. It has gone on for too long, and I hope following this ARF there will be greater political will to come to an agreement, and to put this behind us. Because having the implementation details to the Declaration of Conduct is in itself a confidence-building measure. The fact that we were arguing over the details created certain uneasiness among all the parties involved. But on the whole, I thought [it was] a very good discussion, and [gave] greater clarity on the subject. As a result, a greater hope that we can make progress and keep disputes within bounds, and not allow them to affect the larger peace in the region and the good progress that we are all making.

Question: Such tension between the US and China --- are there any concerns that it may destabilise the East Asian Summit platform?

Minister: There is some tension, which we could detect during the Shangri-La Dialogue, and reports that it was also manifested when the US and China had a strategic dialogue --- I think earlier this year or late last year, I can't remember now --- but again it's over the South China Sea. I thought now the positions are sharply-etched and both sides recognised that, Yes, there are claims, but there are also limits, and we can live with that. That's what's important.

Question: With regard to Myanmar, is there any concern about these reports about its alleged intent to develop nuclear weapons?

Minister: I've read those reports, but Myanmar is part of the Southeast Asian Nuclear Weapons-Free Zone (SEANWFZ), and they are committed to that. They have told us openly that, yes, they are looking at peaceful use of nuclear energy. I think the Russians are helping them, but they have no intention of moving in the direction of nuclear weapons. And not only will it be frowned upon, it will be a serious breach of what makes ASEAN in the first place.

I think what is important in Myanmar is [that] their elections are here, and how successfully those will be held. Unless something terrible happens, we will still have to continue engaging them. I don't see a very sharp break from the present to the future. Continuity is not necessarily a bad thing. The important thing is that their economy should be opened up. Because [of] so many rigidities now which have caused corruption, the economy has been reduced to concessions and licenses and that's bad. You know, that means that they are not growing as fast as they could. It means that the people are suffering unnecessarily, and that the opportunities which now abound in the region are not available to them. So I believe with elections and a move towards constitutional government, behaviour would change and we will see steady progress.

Question: What is the general sense that you got, or there was, in the meeting about the Six-Party Talks with regard to Korea? Is there some optimism that at some point the parties will return or is (inaudible) because we had very strong rhetoric surrounding these military exercises.

Minister: Our fear is of accidents happening. The Korean Peninsula was divided in the last century because of the Cold War. It was divided because the big powers were in contest. Today the big powers do not want trouble with the Korean Peninsula. They may have somewhat different objectives, but by and large, the geo-political contradictions which created the division of the Korean Peninsula in the first place no longer exist today. So it is an unnecessary problem. But we have a legacy and if we're not careful, terrible accidents can happen and many people will die. So it's important to manage this very carefully.

The North Korean government, in fact, has a very weak hand --- its economy is in dire straits, it's very dependant on China --- and China has got important accounts with the US, with South Korea and Japan, which it doesn't want adversely affected. In fact China wants North Korea to move in the direction which China took some time ago, which is maintaining political stability, but at the same time opening up the economy and reforming the structure.

There is a leadership transition now taking place in North Korea; it complicates all their internal calculations. They don't have a strong hand and all they have is this nuclear card, which they have got to play and replay again and again. The important thing now is really to prevent accidents from happening.

Question: Sir, what about the other initiatives that were planned earlier, like humanitarian and disaster relief, things which would have a very practical (inaudible)

Minister: Those are all in hand. They are making good progress. They are all in hand and officials have done very good work. With each natural disaster, there is a feeling that we are better prepared for the next one. And the spirit of cooperation has grown among Ministers, among Leaders, among senior officials --- personal friendships, growing trust and an instinct to work together. In fact, after the closing ceremony when we were bidding each other farewell, we were telling one another that we've got to keep pushing ASEAN integration because all of us recognise that if we do that, if we are strong at the core, then our external policy will continue to succeed. But if you allow the core to be divided, then there will be a lot of trouble. So there is that recognition and it has become almost instinctual.

Question: So, on the topic of (ASEAN) integration, what progress was made in the Connectivity programmes?

Minister: Well, the report is being finalised. The last meeting will be in Singapore, and we should be able to give something quite substantial to the Leaders at the coming Summit. The important thing is that our partners, our friends, are all supportive of this --- not only China and India, but also Japan and (South) Korea, Australia and New Zealand, and I believe the US and Russia as well, once they join the EAS.

Question: Is there any concern that with the full inclusion of the US as a member of the EAS by possibly next year, that this platform might be hijacked between the G2 of US and China?

Minister: Oh yes, there is a danger of the EAS losing its original focus and becoming just another international forum. So the modalities which the Ministers have tasked the officials to work on have become very important. We must make sure that the regional focus is retained, that the existing priority areas remain focussed on, and that the whole Connectivity proposal which is so important to us will be given emphasis, and the possibility of a Free Trade Agreement which binds us all together --- at least the ASEAN Plus Six --- will be retained. I spoke to the Russian Foreign Minister last night, I said, "Would you be interested in CEPEA (Comprehensive Economic Partnership in East Asia), this ASEAN Plus Six Free Trade Agreement idea?" He said, well, they are now thinking in terms of testing out Free Trade Agreements in an experimental way so he kept an open mind. I think the Americans would be interested in the long term, but the trouble is, in the nearer term, Congress has no stomach for it. So we have got to play this: firstly, preserve what we have, but at the same time keep open the possibility of their joining us in the future. The details are very important now. The officials have got to work on this, the Ministers will have to give it a once-over, and present something which will protect our core interest when the matter is put up to the Leaders at the Summit.

Question: Was there a proposal for ASEAN to support the inclusion of Russia into the WTO?

Minister: No, we didn't discuss that. It is not easy because there are some very tough negotiations going on.

Question: Sir, the other question is: Taiwan has again indicated that it is interested in FTAs either individually or with ASEAN as a whole...

Minister: Can we not range all over? Can we just concentrate on the ASEAN Summit? I don't want this to be a general interview.

[Laughter]

Question: Ok, sure.

Minister: Any other subject on what we have discussed?

Question: Yes, just one quick question, if I may. The Third Protocol to the Treaty of Amity and Cooperation --- what is the significance of that?

Minister: We had to make the amendment to allow the EU to accede to the treaty because without that amendment, we could only let countries accede, not a union of countries. So it was a legal requirement and under the rules of the TAC, all high-contracting parties have to agree to the amendment, which was why we needed that big signing ceremony today.

Thank you.

. . . . .